RhodaRose:

--- Along with the parable in Luke about the workers and three in a family against two and two against three I am sure this portion of the Bible's OT can be "worked in" to the thoughts: ---

Much of your Bible passages did not have any connection what so ever into our subject or into divinity of Jesus, so I did cut them out. Sorry if there was also something worth answering that I did not notice (my native language is Finnish), then please point them out more accurately.

--- Quote
Fig tree is symbol of Judaism generally in Bible. Also when Jesus cursed fig tree in Matt.21:19 by words "may no fruit ever come from you again", he probably stated that no more prophets are going to come from Jews.

Mt 11:7-15
And as they departed, Jesus began to say unto the multitudes concerning John, What went ye out into the wilderness to see? A reed shaken with the wind?
But what went ye out for to see? A man clothed in soft raiment? behold, they that wear soft clothing are in kings' houses.
But what went ye out for to see? A prophet? yea, I say unto you, and more than a prophet.
For this is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee. ----

Yep, more than a prophet, prophesied Messiah for Jews, "King of Jews". Now about 33% from our planet is crazy about him, without him they would be polytheistic pagans. Something good in bad. "King of Jews" just said it all, as Jews are one special kind of "problem case", and Christians just one big "freak show" from view of Islam and Muslims...

--- Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.
For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come.---

And those who took it by force were Muslims, when they conquered Rome, Byzantium, so ending home of Christianity.

--- (Mal 4:4-6 Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which I commanded unto him in Horeb for all Israel, with the statutes and judgments. Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD: And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.) ---

"Turn to" is different than "turn against".

--- He that hath ears to hear, let him hear. ---

Qur´an is like music, each Sura has its own melodies even recognized from music of this day.



---De 18:15-22
The LORD thy God will raise up unto thee a Prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto me (Moses) ; unto him ye shall hearken;---

"LIKE UNTO ME" !!! So prophet who is "god" or prophet who is king-prophet Was Moses "god"

----I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.---

Again, "LIKE UNTO THEE", prophet LIKE Moses. Was Moses "god" (Jesus) or king (Mohammed)? Did he survive (Jesus) or did he die and was buried (Mohammed)? Was never accepted by his own nation (Jesus) or was first rejected and then accepted (Mohammed)? Did he teach about pacifism (Jesus) or did he execute people (Mohammed)?

---And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.---

Mohammed (pbuh) said he is last prophet, Jesus did not say so. And as Mohammed, also all Muslims start every day their prayers and reading of Qur´an with words "In the name of most Merciful...".

---But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.---

And so God let Mohammed (pbuh) to recitate Qur´an for 23 years, finish Qur´an with "ending words" just before his death, and accomplish his mission in spreading Islam making sure it will survive?

But paul who died very fast after starting his mission among pagans, is not false prophet?

---And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken?
When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.---

All prophesies in Qur´an happened very soon, and prophesies in hadiths have happened from that time until nowadays. There is reason why even most non-Muslims call him "prophet Mohammed" when referring to him.

Paul did give prophesies for example about coming persecutions of Christians, but those were already happening, and even he himself had done that! Prophecy And only prophet has authority to make teachings into religion, why is Christianity now based mostly on Paul?

--- 2Pe 1:16-2:3
For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.
For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount.---

"Whom I am well pleased", NOT "Whom I have conceived". You Christians are so close to salvation, but just not enough. If you only knew... This is harsh game for those who will promote themselves, and who consider that they can interpretate correctly this mambo-jambo just by his own opinions and feelings, by following other HUMANS who have done the same, without any reasoning based on facts. So think twice before you even try it.

[b]---We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Spirit.
But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.
And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.

Peter plainly states that "there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you"---[/b]

And Jesus told in last supper to disciples that "one of you is satan". Why would he say that about Judas, as according to Jesus it was MENTIONED that he will deceive him (and then Judas run away because Jesus said that)? Of course that is possible, but it is possible also that Jesus was then not speaking about deceit of Judas....

---Jesus was the Last and Greatest Prophet to come and now all we can expect is false prophets and false teachers because our only Teacher is the Holy Spirit---

Jesus did not say he is last prophet. And if he did not say so, why would Peter have right to prophesie so? Was Peter a prophet

--- Joh 14:25-27
These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you.
But the Comforter, which is the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.---

This difference from other passage mentioning "Spirit of Truth" / "Comforter" / "Defender" / "Counselor" in John 16 and in earlier John 14:15-21, there is not said he is "Holy Spirit". In fact could be that in John 14:25-27 is mentioned totally other "Counselor", and so that "Spirit of Truth" mentioned earlier and in John.16 is not "Holy Spirit" (different names as you see).


--- Quote
I mentioned this in my text too. And I gave some explanations about "Christian interpretation". IT IS JUST TRUTH THAT IN CHRISTIAN INTERPRETATION JESUS JUST USED TOO COMPLEX WAY TO DESCRIBE MOST SIMPLE THINGS ALL ALREADY KNEW ABOUT, AND SO HE WAS JUST MAN WITH BIG WORDS? DID JESUS HAD JUST SOME PLEASURE ABOUT MAKING MANY PEOPLE NOT EVEN UNDERSTAND HIM, OR EVEN GOING ASTRAY

I'll make this short and sweet:

Jesus said many times He taught in parables and why. It was a "weeding out" process as to who could "hear" the Spirit Teaching them what Jesus was saying or if they were listening to the world of flesh.
"The proof is in the pudding..." ----

And why do you think that those who "hear Spirit" would be modern Trinity-Christians, and not Muslims, who have more mentions about Jesus in Qur´an more than there is mentions about any other prophet, even about Mohammed (pbuh)?

---Good Night and may God Bless and watch over us,
RhodaRose---

Same back to you.

I just saw this post and want to re-read and digest it before answering but did want to copy a question/answer in another thread that may clear up what I think of Paul:

RhodaRose

You asked: "Where in this verse does it say Jesus, through the Holy Spirit, named His Church christian or even was the originator of christainity?"

It is true that Jesus never called His disciples Christains. They were first called that name in Antioch by unbelievers who observed thet they were just like their master.

When Jesus was alive he operated under the old covenant. And most of what He taught, he taught to people who were under the old covenant. And whenever He spoke to them concerning the new testament, the kingdom of God, they did not understand Him.

JOHN 16:12-13
12"I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. 13But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.

Until the Holy Spirit came, it was impossible to be born again. There could be no new creation before the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus. He is the one that baptises a person into the body of christ.

1 Corinthians 12:13 (Whole Chapter)
"For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. "

That is why Jesus said:

Acts 1:5 (Whole Chapter)
"For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. "

This is the new birth...this is the Born-again experience. This is only by the Holy spirit. So before penticost, before the Holy Ghost was sent, there was no christianity. So the Holy Spirit may not have coined the name 'Christian', but He sure is the origin of the Phenomenon called 'Christianiaty'.

Donnie

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My answer
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Hi Donnie,

You said a mouth full here:



Quote:
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...by unbelievers who observed thet they were just like their master
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....but "who" is their "master" ?
Lets hope it is also an ear full...


Mt 23:8
But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ and all ye are brethren.


Quote:
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When Jesus was alive he operated under the old covenant. And most of what He taught, he taught to people who were under the old covenant. And whenever He spoke to them concerning the new testament, the kingdom of God, they did not understand Him.
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So true. He was showing the old covenant people it could be done, the qualifing and how to move on to the new covenant...the Kingdom of God...and they did not understand and most in the new covenant times do not understand.


Quote:
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Until the Holy Spirit came, it was impossible to be born again.
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Same now, the Holy Spirit must enter and reside within you


Quote:
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This is the new birth...this is the Born-again experience. This is only by the Holy spirit.
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Yes, Yes, Yes


Quote:
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So before penticost, before the Holy Ghost was sent, there was no christianity. So the Holy Spirit may not have coined the name 'Christian', but He sure is the origin of the Phenomenon called 'Christianiaty'.
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No, No, No ... this was from Paul's teachings that christianity was named.

Jesus only said:

Joh 13:35
By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Joh 15:8
Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.

Joh 15:14-15
Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

Please quit calling His' "names" that Jesus did not mention.

Followers of Jesus are either

disciples (learners)

friends (knowing all)

and if they use what they know.....
....Sons of God (trusted of God)

...or would you rather be Paul's christian and never enter His Kingdom ?

Truth in Red

As I re-read this myself I see that it doesn't matter if it is Jesus, Mohammed, Donnie, RhodaRose, AbduRahman, or anyone who speaks the Words from the lips of God in Truth  all are disciples, friends and Sons of God.   

There is no difference if we worship and believe and trust the One and Only God of this Creation.   What's in a name?  It is what is unseen and unsaid that counts in the Kingdom of God.  God is Spirit and He wants the same to praise and worship Him.

We are one in Him

Bless you from the tips of your hair to the tips of your toenails and all those in your presence

RhodaRose

dats y as a man of god its beta to be celibate,cos u might be a good man but your children may spoil your name.